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New Civilization News: Nicotene and Smoking - Don't get Started!!! |
Category: Education 46 comments 3 Dec 2007 @ 19:59 by skillz : YepIm glad i gave up. 3 Dec 2007 @ 20:27 by jerryvest : I know it is one of my greatest accomplishments, just over 30 years ago for me. The tobacco companies are really cancer or poison factories and should not be allowed to exist. I think that the tobacco farmers/corporations are still given government funds to grow their products, but haven't investigated them. Thanks for commenting, Dkill. 4 Dec 2007 @ 14:05 by skillz : Ive dropt the fags but i still would'nt be without a fine cuban cigar every now n then. Cigars are smoked in a different way to fags, the smoke does not enter the lungs. The tobacco plant is a fruity sweet arromatic plant and cant help being that way. Man has just expoited its addictive quallitys for financial gain with the sale of cigaretes (a bastardization of cigars). 4 Dec 2007 @ 14:18 by jerryvest : I'm not a cigar smoker so am not able to share direct knowledge about this 'sport.' However, with a quick search I found an article from the Am. Cancer Society that talks about the dangers, but also indicates there is a need for more research related to addiction. I think the facts are in that it is a cancer producing agent whether you inhale or not. Sorry, dkill. If I were you, I would find something safer to inhale like perfume, a flower, or some fresh air. Thanks for adding comments here. I am hoping others will also share their experiences using these toxic agents, alternatives and prsonal experiences. ****************************** Cigar-Smoking Can Be as Deadly as Smoking Cigarettes Researchers Report Cigar-Smoking Can Be as Deadly as Smoking Cigarettes Article date: 2001/09/07 Smoking cigars is not a safe alternative to smoking cigarettes, according to a paper by American Cancer Society (ACS) researchers published in the Aug. 9 special tobacco issue of the Journal of the American Medical Association. In their paper, Frank Baker, Ph.D., vice president for behavioral research and director of the Behavioral Research Center at the ACS, and colleagues report that cigar smoking is known to cause cancers of the lung and upper aerodigestive tract (oral cavity, larynx and esophagus). According to the researchers: The risk of death from cigar smoking approaches that of cigarette smoking as the number of cigars smoked and the amount of cigar smoke inhaled increases. Smoking cigars instead of cigarettes does not lower risk of nicotine addiction, and cigar-smoking can lead to nicotine dependence even if the smoke is not inhaled. The nicotine in the smoke of a single cigar can vary from about the same as a single cigarette to an amount generated by smoking a pack or more of cigarettes. Rates of cigar-smoking are rising among both adults and teen-agers. Between 1993 and 1997, consumption of all types of cigars in the United States increased by 46.4 percent, reversing a steady decline amounting to 66 percent between 1964 and 1993. Cigars cause more indoor air pollution than cigarettes? including about 20 times the carbon monoxide when a large cigar is compared to a cigarette. "The available scientific knowledge on the health risks of cigar smoking is more than sufficient to conclude that cigar smoking is a cause of cancer and a serious risk to the public health," according to Dr. Baker and colleagues. "Evidence of the health hazards and an alarming increase in rates of cigar-smoking underscore the pressing need for cigars to be included in a coherent national policy on tobacco use and dependence," the researchers say. "Laws and regulations limiting the marketing of cigarettes and access to cigarettes by minors should be applied to all tobacco products." Dr. Baker?s group also says there is a need for more research including studies to examine the nature of tobacco addiction from cigar-smoking. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ACS News Center stories are provided as a source of cancer-related news and are not intended to be used as press releases. 4 Dec 2007 @ 21:07 by athedge : A whole year! Thanks for this article...a reminder that smoking cigarettes was the biggest disservice I have ever done to myself. So typically, on a dare from a friend, I started at age 15. There is nothing like that first drag of your first cigarette to understand just how toxic a cigarette is. It made me sick to my stomach. I thought I would throw up as my head spun. I managed to hold on to my cookies, though, and remember being thankful that I didn't embarrass myself in front of my "way cool" friends. Despite my physical reaction to that first cigarette, I couldn't wait to try again. The feeling of "cool" far outweighed the feeling of "sick" and for the first time in my weird little young life I felt that I was somebody. After many years, when the whole thing was starting to kick my ass, I would think about my corrupting friend and damn him. But it wasn't his fault. He was a kid like me, with all the same insecurities that I had, making his way through the treacherous world of adolescence the best way he knew how. The tobacco companies, however, are another story. They represent true evil. They know about those insecurites and study them. When I see how visciously their products are marketed to young people, I can't help but wonder how such people can lay their heads on their pillows at night and sleep soundly. Maybe they don't. None of my business. On January 5, 2006 (it was supposed to be Jan 1), I smoked my last cigarette after years of trying to cut down, therapy and patches. I still have to force myself to take really deep breaths but at least I CAN fill up my lungs with this sweet fuel of life. Many people in my life have not been so lucky. As I see my dad dragging around an oxygen tank wherever he goes and remember my friend Wally as he struggled, in the last months and weeks of his life, to take in short, quick, unsatisfying breaths ( Oh... that look of terror on his face...) I really do understand how fortunate I am to have had this time without cigarettes. It is the most loving thing I have done for myself ever. It takes what it takes. 4 Dec 2007 @ 21:48 by jerryvest : Great response to a horrible trick that the tobacco companies do to kids and others, Michael. Your story and others will hopefully deter others from getting trapped by these criminal toxic drug dealers. They do know what they are doing as drug predators and will continue to trap our kids and others. I'm certain that congress and other legislators will do nothing to make tobacco a controlled substance as their campaigns are surely receiving many $'s to leave them alone. For me, I was given cigarettes while serving in the military so these corporations hooked us knowing that while we are serving the country, we are also easy targets for them as they know that we are under stress and controlled by the nature of our work. Thus, our psyches don't have many outlets to help balance our tensions and anxieties--drugs serve to relieve the stress for brief periods of time, but the consequences are life threatening as we now know. Btw, I did see the beautiful area in which you now live. That must make life much less stressful and easier to give up these nasty cigs. I think your experience of getting hooked by being cool is so familiar that I'm certain others of us share. 5 Dec 2007 @ 03:25 by jerryvest : Kids who smoke by age 12 are more likely to have alcohol and drug abuse problems than others according to a recent study while teens who start smoking early are more likely to have mental health problems. It seems to me that tobacco should be banned from our society as it is not only related to the high probablility of cancer and other respiratory diseases, but also affects the minds of young and old alike. I think that we must seriously examine our society and evaluate how we treat children and youth in our schools and wider community. We should examine how we put them in schools and make them sit for long hours without proper exercise, health awareness and the values of outdoor education where they can breathe fresh air, experience their relationships with nature and move about their world more freely. I see many college students who walk into class and are not even interested in learning and I suspect that they feel that they will just be tortured some more as they were in primary, middle and high schools. ("high" school is an oxymoron for sure.) And, "higher education" in college must be a joke as so much of this population is depressed and not aware of being mindful and what it means to learn and to develop as a whole being--depression is perhaps at its highest point in our history. I'm sorry if I sound skeptical, but much of my time in class is spent helping students to interact and engage one another in a teaching-learning experience. Most feel that their minds are a sponge and it is the job of the teacher or system to fill it up with more information. Seems to me that schools reflect our society--there is little laughter, joy, creativity and interaction. Smoking is just a means to adapt to these deplorable conditions that our adult population administers while calling it "teaching" and "learning." YUK!!! More of same, don't you think? I have written some logs on these subjects, but there really doesn't seem to be much interest in improving the quality of education and improving the health and wellbeing of students. Many college students that I see are primarily interested in getting out of school, they've had enough lectures and listening to teachers who are also bored and boring, while lacking enthusism, creativity, and spirit. I am curious about others who have observed our education systems and work with students. Perhaps so many of these kids are smoking and killing their spirit because there are so few adults in their social environment who give a damn. Few teachers and parents touch them with their body, mind and spirit. I wish I could paint a pretty picture about education, but art, music & drumming, dance, theater, photography, nature study, martial arts, and exercise are not "high" on the list of priorities for schools and for families, but these are the instruments that make our spirit happy and fulfilled. ************************************* Smoking by Age 12 Related to Alcohol and Drug Abuse, Dependence November 30, 2007 Youths who begin smoking at age 12 or younger are more likely to meet the criteria for past year alcohol and drug abuse or dependence, according to a recent analysis of data from the National Household Survey on Drug Use and Health (NSDUH). Twelve percent of youths who initiated daily smoking at age 12 or younger met the diagnostic criteria for past year alcohol abuse or dependence, compared to 9.6% of those who began smoking at age 16 or older. The difference was more pronounced for illicit drug use. Youths who began smoking at age 12 or younger were more than twice as likely to meet the criteria for marijuana abuse or dependence and three times as likely to meet the criteria for abuse or dependence on an illicit drug other than marijuana. The study also found that teens who start smoking early are more likely to report symptoms of mental illness, such as hopelessness, depression, and worthlessness. According to the authors, "nicotine is hazardous to the adolescent brain, affecting it differently than an adult brain and increasing a young person’s vulnerability to the effects of smoking. The relationship between early smoking and later use of other addictive substances or mental illness may be the result of critical changes in the brain that can be caused by exposure to nicotine." For details, including source information and caveats, download the PDF. Reprinted from CESAR Fax, a weekly, one-page overview of timely substance abuse trends or issues, from The Center on Substance Abuse Research (CESAR) at the University of Maryland. 5 Dec 2007 @ 19:38 by skillz : shaving ban Do we want to live in a governed society where every even remotely harmful practices are forbidden? Knives can be used to harm and kill, but they're an essential part of our lives. Banning tobbacco is just as bad as baning weed which they already have. The more young adults that try new things like weed the wiser adults they will become and the closer we will become to new and better society. If you are bidding for a continuing slave race then yes all mind expanding herbs n plants MUST be outlawed and if tobacco is seen as a path to starting "drugs" then that should be banned too. Without the opinion of an export any person with any more than 2 brain cells can work out that any form of smoke in the lungs is gonna cause harm. I enjoy a good cigar, but that doesn't mean that i uncontrolabley smoke myself stupid every minute of the day. Children of twelve should be under the supervision of their parents, but they're not because the parents have sent them to an institution to learn how to smoke. People need to get a grip on whats really going on. We KNOW that making certain things forbidden does not stop people from doing them, in fact its makes people even more curious. Millions of people take drugs and millions of pounds are made on them worldwide everyday, "laws" (just rules as they really are) are meaningless. And the more people that are exposed to substances like weed the closer we are to bringing down this sick twisted society. It all depends upon what future you want for yourself and your children for many years to come. Although societys rules are a sick joke some people do still live by them. And most of them will find that without enlightenment they will be spending the last years of their short life on REAL establishment drugs that really do kill. Im not going to be afraid to pick up a knife and use it just because the potencial for harm is there. The potencial for harm is everywhere! Lets just all live like battery humans in small cages and by fed by a machine. I give up smoking because i wanted to, but there is no saying that i could continue smoking for life and die from an unrelated illness, its just about being sensible. Because this society has been trained not to be, we have serious health problems. BE SENSIBLE ABOUT LIFE. 6 Dec 2007 @ 00:40 by jerryvest : I get your point dkill and knew that my comment about banning tobacco would draw some flack. However, I don't see that anyone has offered up a solution to the tobacco industry tartgeting kids and teens and others and being predators for their poison. They just go about their business every day getting our kids hooked on their toxic substances and the population is more concerned about losing their "freedom" than the kid's lives. Go figure. Do you have any suggestions for our NCN to deal with these corporate creeps and their drug dealing? Btw, banning a knife is just talking nonsense, while you might compare it to rat poison. I believe that the more responsible position for adults in our society would be to organize an effort to deal with these corporate killers, don't you? Thanks for pariticpating. I know that our country will not do anything worthwhile to protect kids from corporate approved drugs and machine guns. I am just hoping we can find some resonable leadership in the adult world to protect our most prescious resources and our future generations. Kids, as we know, love tobacco and guns, primarily because their adult role models haven't matured enough to be responsible, protective or care about these young, experimental human beings. 6 Dec 2007 @ 02:40 by jerryvest : Facts often speak lounder than words!!! Some interesting facts about the dangers related to nicotene. Tobacco is related to about 20% of deaths or 1 out of 5 cancer related deaths: International Worldwide, approximately 1.1 billion people smoke. In China, more than 70% of men older than 25 years smoke. Smoking is more prevalent in developing countries and is continuing to increase. Prevalence of smoking in North America is decreasing, currently approximately 25% of North Americans smoke. Mortality/Morbidity The health consequences of this addiction are enormous. Tobacco smoking is responsible for 1 of every 5 deaths and is the most common cause of cancer-related deaths in the United States. Children smoke 1.1 billion packs of cigarettes yearly. This accounts for more than $200 billion in future health care costs. Tobacco accounts for more than 85% of all deaths due to lung cancer. Approximately 10 million people in the United States have died from causes attributed to smoking since the Surgeon General's first report in 1964; 2 million of these were from lung cancer alone. Furthermore, tobacco also has been identified as the leading cause of emphysema, COPD, bronchitis, and heart disease. Laryngeal cancer is uncommon; however, in 1988, it accounted for 1.1% of cancer-related deaths in men and 0.3% of cancer-related deaths in women. Oral cancer accounted for approximately 2.1% of male cancer-related deaths and 1.2% of female cancer-related deaths in 1988. Cigarette smoking and tobacco chewing are major causes of this disease. Esophageal cancer accounted for 2.6% of male cancer-related deaths and 1% of female cancer-related deaths. Approximately 50% of overall esophageal cancer mortality is due to cigarette smoking. Bladder cancer accounted for 2.4% of male cancer-related deaths and 1.3% of female cancer-related deaths in 1988; approximately one third of these deaths were related to cigarette smoking. Pancreatic cancer accounted for approximately 5% of cancer-related deaths in 1990; one third of these deaths were associated with cigarette smoking.Kidney cancer accounted for 2.3% of male cancer-related deaths and 1.8% of female cancer-related deaths. Smoking has been established as an independent risk factor for uterine cervical cancer. Anal cancer in both heterosexual men and women also was due largely to cigarette smoking. Interactions between viral factors and tobacco exposure increase cancer risk. Nonsmokers exposed to environmental tobacco smoke have a significantly higher risk of developing cancers and pulmonary diseases. Concentrations of toxins and carcinogens are higher in sidestream smoke. Children exposed to secondhand smoke develop a variety of respiratory disorders and morbidity. Race The smoking rate in the United States is higher among blacks than whites and is steadily increasing in Hispanics. In 1987, 39% of the black male population were smokers, compared to 30.5% of white men; 28% of black women were smokers, as opposed to 26.7% of white women. In addition, 30% of Hispanic men and 18% of Hispanic women were smokers. Sex In the United States, approximately 28% of men and 24% of women smoke. Age Studies reveal that the average age of first-time smokers is 14.5 years and the average age of daily smokers is 17.7 years. Approximately 20% of high school seniors smoke. Please click here to view the full topic text: {link:http://www.emedicine.com/med/byname/Nicotine-Addiction.htm|Nicotine Addiction} 6 Dec 2007 @ 02:58 by jerryvest : Some suggestions by professional may help limit the use of one of our World's most hazardous drugs: Deterrence/Prevention More than 90% of first-time use of tobacco occurs before high school graduation. Because the average age at first use is 14.5 years, smoking prevention must start early. Approximately 40% of teenagers who smoke eventually become addicted to nicotine. Social attitudes and policies toward smoking can have a major impact on smoking behavior. Physician associations, public health organizations, and consumer groups should lobby for the following: Restriction of access to tobacco products for minors Restriction of smoking in public places Restriction of advertisements Increased prices through taxation Increased awareness about the harmful health effects of smoking Patient Education Patient education with regard to the health effects of smoking should occur with all patients who smoke. Patients should be provided with a variety of options and advice that will allow them to escape the harmful effects of tobacco use and the highly addictive drug, nicotine. For excellent patient education resources, visit eMedicine's Public Health Center and Lung and Airway Center. Also, see eMedicine's patient education article Cigarette Smoking. 6 Dec 2007 @ 15:24 by skillz : Yes yes yes we know all the facts but i think that your totaly missing my point. Your still looking for solutions from within the system. The system DOESNT work, it needs to be replaced, all of the facts u state above only confirm this. My point about knives is not nonsense. Knives are like cigaretes in way. The fact that a person may have the desire to harm themselves with a knife does not put blame on the knife. The knife like cigaretes is inanomate. The person on the other hand has free will and will allmost deffinatly have some physicological problems. If the population have the desire to smoke themselves to death then maybee the sanity of the nation needs to be carfuly looked at. Is it gonna come to a stage where we are totaly no longer capable of making any desisions and we all have to wait patciantly inline to be spoon fed some will destroying shlopp by the government. Thats why i said earlier get a grip on reality. What will people turn to once u take away their fags? Knives maybee? 7 Dec 2007 @ 00:29 by jerryvest : Dkill, try and smoke a knife and see what happens. :) I don't accept your example because it - a knife - is not poison and children are not being targeted to inhale it and get addicted by these corporate predators. Children are not at an age of reason where they have the ability to know what the dangers of these chemicals can do to them. It is for this reason that nicotene should be a controlled substance so that the children and teens can't buy it and the tobacco executives will go to jail for promotion of it to youth. Self determination is a principle that applies to adults, not to children. 7 Dec 2007 @ 05:15 by a-d : No we don't know "All the Facts"! The Mainstream Lay Person, like yourselves know only what some most likely bias person/Corp wants you to know!..... There's a lot of Secrets about Health and Illness that Mainstream has NOOOO clue about other than the propaganda lines!.... Smoking is no different from any other intake: excess is excess and can harm us BUT when used CORRECTLY ( in right amounts) as the Cocooning "drug" that it is, there is no damage -provided one smokes something that isn't laden with some four hundred and more ARTIFICIAL CHEMICALS that the chemical Industry wants to get rid of and found that (commercial cigs are the perfect place to hide them and get paid for!... just like fluoride in the drinking water!.... The big question is : how much is the original Tobacco Plant genetically modified -or is it only hybridized? White BLEACHED Wheat flour -I bet- is more toxic than natural Nicotine. So is -for sure- what is called REFINED sugar and salt; the way they are altered and -used in that altered state. Cow's MILK (as milk/in milk form) is one of THEE MOST POISONOUS things Humans can indulge! Very few people IN the whole Western World know how real, FRESH --as 'non RANSID'-- Butter really tastes!.... because only very few have any had the luck and priviledge to taste non-ransid FRESH Butter!... Ransid is not especially good for us!... Clogging arteries and making our blood ever more acid!... We haven't even touched the real Killer yet: ALCOHOL!!! THEE nr ONE Poison of the world, next to regular Milk (-especially the way Milk is treated/"butchered"!... You think opium/heroin is nr one?!? Think again! Alcohol, the perfectly legal, the-never-touted-about drug, that is the bottom cause to -what the Establishment accepts to admit to being the real Cause and Culprit of minimum SIXTY % of all Hospital Bed spaces!... In other words; at least /or MORE than sixty % of all patients in Hospitals are there DUE TO ALCOHOL USE!... their Illness as a direct result of ALCOHOL!!!!... Did you know that? Nicotine as cancer causing chemical is never proven - and as far as I know, never really tested... why... because the Medical Establishment; certainly the top guys, KNOW the truth!... Nicotine is NOT the cause... the OTHER ADDED CHEMICALS are -whenever (lung)cancer is considered as a result of smoking ( I have in my decades of nursing met four people/patients with lung cancer and only one of them had ever smoked! And as a Private person, out in the Society, I have never net anyone with lung cancer! NONE... I can't count how many COLON Cancers and SERIOUS Liver diseases I have ran into -both as a Nurse in side the Hospital -world and as a private person outside of it. No. I am NOT advocating for any one to get into smoking, but I sure as hell ain't gonna pretend that is the killer activity either!.... I know much too much of the real truth to do so!... just like I know too much about the truth about vaccinations and "research" around it, to advocate the benefits of vaccinations ( there are NONE -beyond making some Pharmas reaaally , really rich! A really deliciously good cigar every once in while!...ahhhh...Steve, you "shouldn't" have reminded me!... hahahah... I'm gonna get my self a really good one!... I haven't written even half of the facts and things here that I could!... heheh but I just had to make a little note of the true DESTROYER out there: ALCOHOL! and yet, I loooove good Ale; hig quality European Ale or Beer!...But how often do I do it, so to speak, and how much???... Once a year maybe, and only one glass... that plasters me... I have NO tolerance for alcohol.. I get drunk, just from smelling the cork, my friends tell me! : ) Ohh, this info I have to give you: It IS PROVEN that Nicotine is NOT ADDICTIVE!!! It is the OTHER CHEMICALS , like Salpeter, that are the addiction creating ones!... that's part of why they are added!.... What Propaganda you read is not always the true truth!...about anything at all! Always try to dig deeper and around the Issue -and you'll be surprised... -specially when it comes to food and social party/entertainment habits of something we eat/indulge in one form or the other. 7 Dec 2007 @ 14:07 by jerryvest : Yes, Astrid, I read that the additives to tobacco were very dangerous and caused great danger to our body-minds. Also, even though the US has stopped spraying DDT on crops, many foreign countries have not and that is an additional hazard for world populations who inhale this poison. Anyway, the tobacco predatory industry is very prosperous and paying off our legislators, much like the Big Pharmas. 7 Dec 2007 @ 16:22 by a-d : Commercial Cigs.... ... just like ANYTHING else in and for COMMERSIAL use are made as the Devil's Concoction... be it Milk, cigs or sugar!... for the Mainstream Person; who is not-"too" -much-into-own critical-thinking...; the one who wants nothing more but be a brainless SHOPPER/CONSUMER) So, these Commodities are all made for them and all "the SAME" = filled to the brim with things that -guaranteed- will HARM the Consumer, so that S/he eventually HAS to go to the Doc, get some Pills... ahhh, well... you know the drill... you know the CYCLE. The more I ponder over Gandhi's statement: "Be the Change you want to see" the more wisdom I see in it and the more it makes it possible for me to actually just do that: CHANGE my life into being what I really want life to be!: CARING for ALL and GENTLE to ALL. One tiny tiny step at the time, but always onward and forward -as the saying goes. Feels good! : ) 7 Dec 2007 @ 18:28 by jerryvest : Excellent comment, Astrid. I love Gandhi's words as well. We are part of nature and it is important for us to be responsible and respectful of our roots, partners and of our relationships. As you also note, it is important for us to be conscious, critical thinkers as our watch dogs such as the Food and Drug Administration(FDA) and congress are only puppets of the greedy and corrupt corporations that run/ruin our country. Thank you. 7 Dec 2007 @ 21:03 by a-d : Click here http://www.yesmagazine.org/default.asp?ID=241 /// and you will access an article in "YES" Magazine that talks exactly about Gandhi's "Advice" to Humankind. Your PC's "Back" Button should be lit up now and then clicking on that, will take you back one page, where you will find more inspirational (small) articles how People all over are taking charge of their lives and re-claiming their Divine rights to be their own "Me" and Do The Right Thing! (I just love what "YES" has to offer us! : ) )) Hope many more will be inspired! 8 Dec 2007 @ 17:59 by skillz : Said better then i could have Thanx Astrid for for comming in on this subject, im fully with you on every part of your above comments. Jerry the example of the knife was a great one , your just choosing not to see the greatness of it. 8 Dec 2007 @ 19:00 by jerryvest : I'm fully in agreement with both you and Astrid, Dkill. After all is said and done, I know nothing. I remember an old world war II show where one of the guards in a camp was always being in the wrong place at the wrong time and he always said: " I know nothing, I know nothing at all." Anyway, I enjoy discussing smoking and tobacco and the other ingredients with you both. The point I am attempting to raise is that if we can stop kids from getting started smoking at early ages, then they have a good chance to stay free of these addictive chemicals. I also think we can introduce mindfulness to our kids early on so that they can develop skills to see through these predators. Many of us can look back on how we got trapped early on and hopefull pass on our wisdom to next genterations. Is this a noble effort or what? 10 Dec 2007 @ 19:22 by skillz : Contradiction Im not quite sure what you mean by the ww ll story but i wrote something a few years back that sounds similar - "I know little and most THINK less than that." Which may only make sense to ME but i wrote it anyway. Mr vest, you are raising 2 conflicting points. First you are saying we need to stop kids from harming themselves by eliminating the harm, bringing forth the ban on the harm. Then your saying we need to indroduce mindfulness to our kids and pass on our wisdom. Dictating rules and boundreys is neither mindful or wise. Naturual human programing (instinct) is to break boundreys anyway (at least the strong will), we've put a man on the moon, and posibley most of the motivation for that was because for years many have said that we cant. Just because we may hear wise words does not make us wise. Rules are not words of wisdom. You either create a robot human where rules and comands are nessercery, or you insight self awareness and free thought into a human from birth and your human will teach itself, eliminating the need for rules. Im fairly sure we are all capable of this. And finaly, do you really believe that if smoking is banned that this will acctualy stop people from smoking? Weed is illegal, has this stoped it from being smoked? When you started smoking as a kid it was not allowed, but this didnt stop you from trying it and getting hooked. Banning tabbaco will just make it even kooler for the youngsters, and every teenager wants to be kool. Weed is and amazing herb and an essential part of human mental growth and healing, but i know that most kids desire to smoke it because its seen as kool, and because there being naughty and we all get a kick out of being naughty sometimes. LIFE IS THERE TO BE LIVED. 10 Dec 2007 @ 22:10 by jerryvest : Hello, dkill...I'm not sure what you mean about rules and contradictions. Society creates rules, primarily through the courts as a means to protect us to provide safety and from injury, poison such as DDT and other chemicals that are harmful, etc. Tobacco and the ingredients included in it are some of the most harmful elements known to our scientists. You've seen the statistical evidence and know this as a fact, yet you want to keep these chemicals in the market place without any protection for kids and others. Why wouldn't you want to protect others from harm when you know they may never be the same once they become addicted to these chemicals? I recognize that adults can self-determine, so I am only focusing here on our children an youth. The tobacco companies know that if they can get youth to try these products early on, they will have them hooked for life. This is why their advertising always show cowboys riding horses and showing off their tattoos--it's cool and attractive to young minds. Anyway, no one is making robots out of children when we teach them mindfulness early on. They learn how to see that these commercials are predatory and out to get them. I don't really know if banning is the right way to go as I also lived during prohibition and that never worked; however, there are other alternatives that our governing bodies can do to protect our children and youth from great harm. They do it with drivers licenses and prescription drugs. Sure, kids will be kids, we can attest to that. I tried tobacco as a young kid, but joined sports teams, music and other groups so didn't get hooked until I went into the military and we got free cigs--seemed that it calmed our stress and anxiety, but that was before the dangers were published--it was rare to be with anyone who didn't and the movies received extra money by the tobacco companies to portray our heroes--Clark Gable, William Holden, Humphrey Bogart, etc. as our role models. I'm not going to get engaged in the wisdom of pot here as my intent is to show the dangers of tobacco and its ingredients. I think that there is evidence that pot has some benefits for persons with cancer and other diseases. I also think that more research should be done on this drug as I haven't seen much evidence that it has a direct link to cancer that is shown with chewing tobacco, pipes,cigars, and cigarettes. The real point for me is, let's follow the suggestions that are introduced in an earlier post by the American Cancer Society and others. Thanks for participating here, dkill. You do seem to enjoy a good argument and I'm not sure I can offer that for you. Perhaps others can help us out. Best wishes, Jerry. "Participation In High School Activities Lowers Risk Of Smoking 3 Years After Graduation ScienceDaily (Dec. 8, 2007) — Researchers from the Abramson Cancer Center of the University of Pennsylvania reported today that students who participate in high school sports or individual physical activity are less likely to smoke than their classmates. The new study indicates that the protective effect of participation extends at least three years beyond graduation. The Penn team discovered, however, that girls do not derive the same level of protection from school sports as do boys." {link:http://pennhealth.com/} Btw, I wonder how many of you have visited a nursing home as I suggested earlier to discuss this issue with some of our elders who are living out their lives with oxygen masks and struggling to breathe and interact with others. Hmm, I feel great compassion for our elders who got hooked early on without knowing these great dangers. One thing we can discuss with our youth: What is the possible impact for your future life, health and relationship by smoking this cigarette? 11 Dec 2007 @ 08:15 by vaxen : Free Culture Here is a free download (pdf) of Professor Lessigs' "Free Culture," jerry, that you might be interested in if you don't already have the book. Others, as well, could benefit from a perusal of this seminal work. http://www.free-culture.cc/images/cover.gif http://www.free-culture.cc/freecontent/ 11 Dec 2007 @ 15:14 by jerryvest : Thanks, Vax....I'll look into it for sure. I have already dedicated my creative works to the public domain. I hope this helps to get our use of safe, skillful and nourishing touch out to a wider community. I appreciate that you are keeping us informed about the true nature of freedom. 11 Dec 2007 @ 20:13 by vaxen : So... that is your family in the picture above, jerry? What is the beautiful place, top right (monitor left) that you are looking out over? I don't know how informed I am keeping anyone about the true nature of freedom but I appreciate the thanks anyway. Here is another cool link I think you might want to contemplate as it is related to the scourge of smoking for that others may profit handsomely from your slow death. Welcome! The Freecycle Network is made up of 4,188 groups with 4,177,000 members across the globe. It’s a grassroots and entirely nonprofit movement of people who are giving (& getting) stuff for free in their own towns. It’s all about reuse and keeping good stuff out of landfills. Each local group is moderated by a local volunteer (them’s good people). Membership is free. To sign up, find your community by entering it into the search box above or by clicking on “Browse Groups” above the search box. Have fun! http://www.freecycle.org/ 11 Dec 2007 @ 20:22 by a-d : Funny..... ... reading Steve's Words of Wisdom vis a vis teaching/bringing up Kids vs what Jerry said.... In truth; BOTH approaches are NEEDED and equally important in that process! : ) I know; had my Mom not understood (to use) G=BOTH these approaches in bringing me up I would have much more difficult time to find my own Life Truth/Path and I would have much "worse" as a human...and I've bad enough as it is!... Yet, I can see how much I benefitted from her knowing to use both methods interactively -or "as needed/demanded by the situation/Task at Hand! :) = = (: Thank you -both- for putting these "Methods" into simple easy understood words/"Ho-to"-explanations! 11 Dec 2007 @ 21:14 by jerryvest : Thanks for the referral to this "Freecycle Network"--I'll look into it. Vax, what is so great about our NCN and our participants is that we are introduced to various articles, research and groups who can help us learn more about our topics of interest. The mountain view that we are looking from is "Cooper's State Park" overlooking the Mongahela(sp)River, about 30 miles north of Morgantown, WVA. Whenever we go East, we stop in my wife's hometown and camp in this beautiful spot. We were quite young then as our kids are now 39 & 40, but we still have great memories of these camping experiences. Vax, thanks for your splendid contributions to this discussion. Astrid, you are a very good peace keeper and have special skills in bringing out the best in others (us). Thanks again. Jerrysan 12 Dec 2007 @ 15:26 by skillz : Jerry Jerry Jerry You are looking at life from one dimension, the systems dimension of capitalism and cunsumerism. Its as if you have no understanding of humans, only containing humans. "Society creates rules, primarily through the courts as a means to protect us to provide safety and from injury, poison such as DDT and other chemicals that are harmful, etc" Are u a government text book? Coz u sound like one. You obviously believe the above statement as true, i am wasting my time with you. To get any kind of true understanding in life you will need to drop your present mentality and start from scratch. Im gonna make a wild guess here and assume that you have never taken any psycedelics in your life? And if you have you havent used them correctly. You are a prime example of a 1 dimensional mindset that never grows because it has never been given the correct nutrients. But you just sit there with your mind closed and wait for scientist and "experts" to prove that. Thanx for confirming what i allready know and supports an earlier artical i wrote on drugs. I pitty you but at the same time angry at you because you support the very thing that i oppose. 12 Dec 2007 @ 19:23 by jerryvest : Dkill, you are very judgmental and projecting your own lack of knowledge, wisdom and experience onto me. I would suggest that you examine each statement that you made about me and add..."and, this is my existence." For sure what you say has nothing to do with me. You are very wrong about everything you think you know about me. I was a 60's generation guy so I can say that I know psychodelics as well as anyone. I didn't abuse them as you have described in your logs, so I maintain a clear mind and am quite conscious and responsible for what I do as a human being. After all is said and done, Freedom=Responsibility. I also am very active with working with youth-at-risk, juvenile offenders, soldiers, others and have worked in many of our prisons and mental hospitals throughout my professional life, so I know what happens when people "go out their doors of compensation or cross the mental, physical, spiritual and emotional boundaries" as we have a very unforgiving society that will punish rather than treat its offenders. Anyway, you are old enough to know better about what our society is about and what happens when you have anarchy where the population isn't in agreement about its rules and laws. I know that we have been experienceing this within our corporations and our government, especially during the past 7+ years. I'm not here to defend myself, but I would appreciate that you go back and read some of my early logs where I have introduced changes in many of our systems, including prisons, mental health, schools, etc. I practice what I teach every day and I am not denying you the opportunity to interact with me on my logs. But, please, stop believing that you know me, you don't. And, dkill, do find some other log to dump your ill will. 12 Dec 2007 @ 19:47 by bushman : Hmm, in my oppinion the system goes too far to protect the, lets say stupid people, what the system does is promote de-evolution of humanity by blocking natural selection, people complain the world is over populated, and its no wonder why. May I point you all to a book? Its called "Nanny State" {http://www.nannystatebook.com/index.html} 12 Dec 2007 @ 21:16 by jerryvest : Hi Bushman,,,,are you sure that we should read something that Tucker Carlson supports?:) I can't think of anyone who is more out-to-lunch than this guy. And, I think it is true if we are protecting the stupid people like Bush and Co. who have done all they can to destroy everything of value in this country, I would read this book with pleasure. The politicians, especially the "R's" say how bad our government is and then they put all of their incompetent, evangelical and corporate friends in the key leadership positions, including the courts, to guarantee it's total ineffectiveness and destruction. Thus, our government can't work for everyone in terms of justice, economics, education, equality, etc. with these slugs in charge. For those of us who have been here on NCN and following these discussions for many years about the failures, do know, however, what you are talking about. Thanks for joining the discussion. 12 Dec 2007 @ 21:48 by bushman : lol, well I for one dont care what someone I dont know thinks, I do care to see why others think stuff, in that just because someone that some people dont like, suports a certine position, either way Im just saying theres whats appropriate for the times at the extreem ends, gov and others go way too far to make us safe from ourselves, enevitably taking away god given rights. 12 Dec 2007 @ 22:05 by jerryvest : Ok, Bushman...I understand and appreciate your concerns about losing our rights. Can you also see that corporations like Tobacco Companies target kids at an early age before they even know what their rights are as human beings and get them addicted through their predatory advertising campaigns. This is why I wrote this log to put out an awareness notice to defend and protect those who are unable to protect themselves. I have written similar logs about drugging our kids by psychologists, psychiatrists, the mental health industry and the Big Pharmas. Our parents, teachers and other caring adults should be advocating for our young people and opposing these giant multi-nationals who pay off legislators and others to get their way with our children. Do what you wish as an adult and accept the consequences can be the message for adults. Perhaps you and dkill are not getting my point here. What more can I say to make it clearer? 12 Dec 2007 @ 22:59 by bushman : Well, I do agree that corps need new meat, to replace those that die or figure it out, I agree with putting restrictions on advertizing of many things that are prooven harmful. And in my book parents have to be a proper roll model, as in telling the kids how bad smoking is while they have a cig hanging from thier lips, is just another advertizment to smoke. But as well there are many things that take risk and bumps and bruises, with out the expiriance or kids live in fear of everything that might hurt them but in all likly hood makes them stronger once they become adults. So I toaly agree with your log post, what I dont agree with is control by the state. I think its up to the parents to do thier homework and raise thier kids right. But not by useing fear of death, or like religions do thru fear of going to hell. I dont need to bring up the lies that reffermadness proposed to us kids, but I do like the new anti meth commercials. There is such a thing as over protection too. Theres plenty of brands of cigs that dont put chems and overly addictive aditives, as well everything in this world chem or not can be addictive to some persons. Again the more laws made only creats a black market, as we saw when they tryed to outlaw alcohal. I do see your point of view and agree with most of it. :} 13 Dec 2007 @ 19:14 by athedge : Imagine a snow-laden slope rising high above the edge of a cliff. Imagine a boy of 14 years playing at the bottom of this slope -- not too near the edge -- his parents have warned him that that would not be wise. Mom and Dad know that there are no guarantees in life and security is an illusion, a story we tell ourselves to ease our anxiety about how dangerous the world is. They don't want their son to grow up in fear so they have developed some parenting skills around becoming less fearful themselves so as to be a good example to their beautiful son whom they love with all their heart. At the top of the slope, a man appears. He reaches down and gathers up an armful of the wet, sticky snow and forms a large ball. He grins a little and heaves the ball in the general direction of the boy. It lands on the slope about 100 feet below and begins to roll faster and faster towards the boy. The ball gathers more and more snow around itself, becoming a massive boulder heading straight for the still unaware boy. The boy has heeded his parents wishes and has stayed a good ways away from the edge but does not think to look up towards the top of the slope. It doesn't occur to him that danger could come from there. The grin on the man at the top of the slope slowly widens into a smile and he begins to laugh to himself. He had not been sure that he would be successful, but his intent was to hit the boy and knock him off the edge of the cliff and it looked as though he was about to get his wish and this pleased him. As the story-tall boulder crashed into the unsuspecting boy, the man on the slope let out a roar of delight and exclaimed, "One more child at the bottom of the cliff to add to my collection. Boy, am I getting good at this!" He made a mental note to himself to return the following day. One , I suppose, could try to argue that it wasn't the man at the top of the slope who killed the boy. It was the snow boulder. Or maybe you could argue that the boy should have been more alert and should therefore, have been able to get out of the way. Or perhaps human children should not be so helpless and need so much supervision, an inherent flaw in the species. But I don't think any of these arguments have any merit. I agree that you cannot ban snow or even the formation of snowballs, but certainly if you throw a snowball down a snow-laden slope with an intent to hit a helpless child you should be held accountable for that and be prevented from ever doing it again. It is murder, after all. Sorry for the melodrama. I long for a day when the spiritual consciousness of the planet would render these discussions unnecessary. PEACE :) 13 Dec 2007 @ 21:41 by jerryvest : Good metaphor, Michael... Yes, it would be so great to have a responsible, respectful and compassionate humanity that understood our relationhips with one another and with our true nature. Even here in a NCN discussion forum there is not concensus on what consciousness or spirituality represents. Perhaps at some point we could discuss the various "levels of consciousness" as described in John Lilly's book, _Center of the Cyclone_ or directly from Oscar Ichazo's work as identified in his book _Between Metaphysics and Protoanalysis_. Where I found these levels as useful is that we can begin to recognize our beliefs as we interact. They are also introduced in the Tarot as a map of our human or ego development experiences--eg. Master-Slave to Disillusionment and Despair. For example, in our western form of psychology, when someone becomes depressed and feels like killing their ego, this psychic level is considered a lower level; however, when we rise to this level of experience, our egos have absorbed about as much pain and suffering that we can handle. This is where an integrative health professional can empower this person to examine their beliefs and work toward becoming free of these ego mechanisms-patterns of conditioning and achieve spiritual freedom. Unfortunately, western medicine puts the person on drugs and rarely introduces them to a daily health routine that would include meditation, massage, exercise, mindfulness and other methods that can help them integrate their whole being--physical, mental, emotional and spiritual development. 14 Dec 2007 @ 17:50 by athedge : I believe it would be a pleasure to have those conversations with you. I have not read either one of these books yet. I look forward to becoming familiar with them. I will pick them up this weekend. Thank you, friend! 14 Dec 2007 @ 18:03 by skillz : The point... you are trying to make has been got for years. The government allready has the policy of banning something that may potencialy be a threat to there society. Now correct me if im wrong but you are saying that the solution to the problems brought about by instituations (schooling, advertising, news media, the law, policing, proppagander, prisons) is to create MORE instituations? By making lighting up a cigarete a crime you are just creating more maddness. Will our future prisons start filling up with smokers? I dont believe that you would intend to make the world worse but then all of the madness the wars the suffering of children the poverty of "3rd world" countrys, all that was driven by GOOD INTENSIONS. You want a better world like we all do but you have no clue to the correct path. And yes i am being judgemental after reading YOUR ideas and views. Bushman I think for once i agree with some of your views above. Anyway got to dash to work. 14 Dec 2007 @ 18:10 by skookum : Smoking cigarettes gave my step father COPD and lung cancer. He was 62 when he died. He had no other health problems. He was a brilliant man. Lost too soon to a preventable disease. Of course he got addicted way before the anti smoking campaigns of recent years. Education and supportive programs help. I just wish there was some way to take the 'cool' reputation away from the activity of smoking. Parents need to stop smoking if they don't want their kids to start. Most kids who start smoking, in my opinion have probably been exposed daily by their parents to second hand smoke. 14 Dec 2007 @ 18:27 by jerryvest : Yes, we do lose our loved ones from smoking and it is too bad in this day and age that parents will continue to teach their kids that it is ok. I also think that the reports show that tv shows and movies that continue to show the actors or stars smoking contributes to the "coolness" of it. Thanks for sharing your personal experiences of losing a family member from this disease that is so preventable. During my early experience as a graduate student, working in a rehabilitation center, I had a client who even continued to smoke cigarettes while the smoke came out of his throat. He had his larynx removed because of cancer in his throat and had to learn to talk again with the help of a speech therapist. Hmm, there is no doubt in my mind that this is a very powerful addiction that even surgery won't prevent the smoker from withdrawing. 15 Dec 2007 @ 17:59 by skillz : Dont snow throw balls. If i may add to your comment athedge i would say that proper guidence by the parents could have avoided this dissaster from an oppotunist. If the boy was brought up to be aware of all danger he would not have to be told of the edge so it would not been the focus of his safety. Following orders is not thinking for ourselves. Corporations live off of peoples unwiseness. Not much time today, bye. 15 Dec 2007 @ 19:41 by jerryvest : Yes, corporations are cold blooded and have no "wiseness" when it comes to selling their products and getting kids hooked as we've discussed here. Yesterday, I read an article about how alike the Big Pharmas and the Tobacco Companies are when it comes to lieing, cheating and getting away with it because they buy off their watch dog agencies and other governmental entities--eg. researchers and the media. Seems that corporate predators outnumber the investigation organizations 30 to 1. I realize that this gets beyond the point about drugging our kids, but I know that there are those that believe that fighting against the corporate criminals, we are only diminishing the freedom for Americans. But, we must remember, individuals behind their corporate greed are covered by protective measures and they rarely have to assume any responsibility for their actions--we do. Children, on the other hand, are treated terrible when they break a law and there are very few advocates for them once they enter the (no)justice system. The ones I work with have good reason to be pissed off and angry at our society and others. They learn early on that no one really cares--after all, for many of them their dads left them abandoned and didn't care about them when they were there. Today, most kids grow up with single parents who are doing all they can to provide for their family, often working for minimum wages. Anyway, after awhile its easy for me to see the kids side of the story and resent our corporations by knowing they can get the kids hooked on their poison and they have them for a lifetime. {link:http://www.corporatepredators.org/} **************************************** This is how they target kids in school using adult magazines: HARRISBURG,PA - Attorney General Mike Fisher announced that four major tobacco companies, whose advertising has appeared in Time, Newsweek and U.S. News and World Report, have agreed to the request by the nation’s Attorneys General that they remove cigarette and smokeless tobacco advertisements from magazines that are sent to schools as part of their educational programs. Fisher, one of the Attorneys General who negotiated the 1998 national tobacco settlement, welcomed the action by Philip Morris USA Inc., R.J. Reynolds Tobacco Co., Brown & Williamson Tobacco Corp. and U.S. Smokeless Tobacco Company. "Students across Pennsylvania and the country read these magazines," Fisher said. "I am pleased that the companies have agreed to stop advertising in these publications. This is a continuation of our efforts to stop tobacco companies from marketing to kids." Fisher said the magazines’ school programs, known as Time Classroom, Newsweek Education Program, and U.S. News Classroom Extension Program, distribute hundreds of thousands of magazines to high school and middle school classrooms in the United States each week. For example, about 300,000 copies of Newsweek are distributed to participating classrooms and each copy is read by an average of 3.5 students, representing an estimated total audience for Newsweeks' classroom program alone of one million students. The four tobacco companies had placed approximately 120 cigarette and smokeless tobacco ads in these three magazines from January 2002 through June 2003. Major magazine publishers employ a process called "selective binding" or "copy split," which allows advertisers to place their ads in certain copies of the magazine and not in other copies. In June, the Tobacco Enforcement Committee of the National Association of Attorneys General wrote to the four companies, asking that they make arrangements with the publishers to ensure that their tobacco ads did not appear in the classroom editions. After discussions between the companies and the Attorneys General, the four major companies agreed to eliminate their ads from those editions. Related links · More about State News · News by Editor -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Most read story in State News: Last Tanker Fire Doused at PA Train Derailment Site 17 Dec 2007 @ 20:50 by skillz : I think theres.. one small fact that your overlooking. Tobbacco has been on this planet long before corporations and even before us humans walked the earth. People and plants have a sinergy together. They give us something and we grow them because we use them. People have been smoking all kinds of herbs and plants long before advertising and governments and doctors and health warnings. But we still exist today. How did we survive without these instituations to guide us? How come we all didnt smoke ourselves to death from birth? Just for a minute forget that our instituations exsist. Now, what are YOU going to do about YOUR childs safety? If YOUR child starts smoking at an early age and dies early its YOUR fault. You cant blame tobbaco companys for being successful. People must WANT to smoke. If a new brand of cola hit the market that werent as tasty as the other brands it wouldnt sell. Tobbaco sells itself. Let people have their fags. Ive given up the fags but i still fill my body with something far more destructive - FOOD. Being a single guy on the go i tend not to spend much time shopping and cooking so i find myself living off fatty fast convenience foods. Something even more deadly than both of them is NO EXERCISE. Ive heard of tribes that start there children smoking from as early as 1 and these people have never been exposed to any advertising from tobbaco companys as they grow there own. BE SENSIBLE, LIVE WELL. 17 Dec 2007 @ 20:59 by jerryvest : Here is a good article describing prevention and the extent of this hazardous product, how it is promoted knowing the extent of killing others with their poison. What's your interest in promoting tobacco? "Tobacco is the leading preventable cause of death: cigarettes and other tobacco products kill 420,000 American smokers and 53,000 nonsmokers every year. This toll exceeds the deaths resulting from alcohol abuse, AIDS, traffic accidents, homicides, and suicides combined . Nevertheless, the tobacco industry continues to promote and sell its products, unhampered by any meaningful government regulation except for mostly local restrictions designed to protect nonsmokers from the toxins in secondhand tobacco smoke. In fact, the tobacco industry is unique among American and worldwide industries in its ability to forestall effective government regulation and to hold effective public health action at bay while marketing its lethal products. The industry manages this, despite the overwhelming scientific evidence that tobacco products kill, through a combination of skilled legal, political, and public relations strategies designed to confuse the public and to allow it to avoid having to take responsibility for the death and disease it inflicts." Link to this item {link:http://www.nyu.edu/socialwork/ip/grey_lit/archives/2007/12/the_cigarette_papers.html} 10 Jun 2009 @ 00:43 by jerryvest : Congress is About to Vote on Tobacco Take a look at the Bill that Congress will pass related to the Tobacco Co's. (legal cartels) I think the Tobacco Industry wrote the Bill as they know we must "protect" the children. But, they don't give a damn about anyone and never did. They have poisoned and addicted us to their product. I wrote a personal log on this subject that had lots of interesting comments. Let me know what you think about this 3rd. Degree Drug--Cancer's Best Friend. Do you think anything of substance (in the real sense of the use of this concept) will happen? I will try to maintain my HOPE!!! 29 Apr 2016 @ 06:14 by Bandar Togel @103.12.162.4 : brilliant! I would like to share this ar Togel Online Singapore Togel Online Hongkong Bandar Togel Singapore Bandar Togel Togel Online Terpercaya Bandar Togel Online Terpercaya Togel Online Agen Togel Online Terpercaya Agen Togel Online Other entries in Education 28 Apr 2016 @ 17:25: cosmology-vedas-interlinks-and-knowledge-expansion-cosmological Index 29 Jun 2010 @ 02:35: LARGE CLASS, MAD DISCOURSE: SAME ROOTS 9 Jun 2010 @ 18:31: Spilling The Beans.. 22 Dec 2008 @ 05:55: Third Week 22 Nov 2008 @ 23:39: The L Word – part two and a half (baked) 28 Aug 2008 @ 05:12: Catherine 22 Aug 2008 @ 05:21: Final Exams 4 Apr 2008 @ 13:12: EDUCATION IS DEFICIENT FOR GIFTED MINDS 3 Apr 2008 @ 20:25: Welcome to the ratrace. 13 Feb 2008 @ 08:36: Horizon
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30 Nov 2007 @ 19:54, by Gerald Vest