The new civ servers are moving to another T1 line tomorrow, in
Synchronicity's Beverly Hills office rather than the old one in Venice,
California, which means they'll be down for a couple of hours. If your
messages to NCN mailing lists bounce, just re-send them again afterwards.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Below are some more responses to the recent messages about projects and
organization for NCN.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Martin Erasmus <fabulous@fireball.smartnet.co.za>
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 12:55:06 +0000
Subject: NCN structuring proposal
I am a fairly recent addition to NCN and thus may have missed out on
important dialogue concerning the issue of structuring NCN.
My proposal is this: let us experiment and try out various ideas
under the wing of NCN. We can establish various virtual societies
within NCN to see how they work out, and then empirically determine
what would and would not work.
Some friends of mine and I have been working on a concept for an
online state, but its precepts and propositions may not appeal to
all, so give us some more time to work out details and announce our
proposal. Those who feel that they can identify with our proposal can
then join and we can try it out. We would like to use January 1 2000
as our official launch date, and reserve the name "Internation" for
the experiment.
We are looking forward to hearing from you and investigating the
proposals of other groups, and the ensuing dialogue.
Thank you very much,
Martin Erasmus,
Pretoria, South Africa.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Paul-Joseph Scott <jno@jno.ndirect.co.uk>
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 20:56:47 +0000
Subject: Democracy & NCN Part 2
I have an idea about the way you might run the NCN. I have read your emails
and ones from other people about NCN earning money etc. I think the problem
with the NCN at the moment is democracy. In my experience if people are not
directly asked questions they shy away from giving suggestions.
My proposal is maybe the NCN could ask members to vote on certain questions
affecting the network. For example in the email that is sent on a regular
basis
to members could ask the question
"Should members pay for the service? Yes { } No { } Unsure { }"
People wanting to vote could just press reply and add an x to the box they
decided on.
Thanks for listening to my proposal.
Paul-Joseph Scott
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Charles Schwager <CSchwager@ProHEALTHcare.com>
Subject: RE: NCN Organization [from Bruce B.]
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 10:29:18 -0500
All of the people in NCN have good ideas and the ability to make this vision
happen. The problem is the "man power". I came across NCN completely on
accident. I am sure there are thousands upon thousands of people that would
be interested in a worldwide project such as this. Emancipation of land
from a government would be an Ideal thing, but due to what I know of our
status, it is unrealistic. To start a society of "higher purpose", we would
need to publicise and get the word out about NCN on a global scale. If I
wasnt at work, working on a project, I would never have even heard on NCN.
That thought itself is a little discouraging. Fortunately we do have
several types of media like Television or Radio, that we can pass the word.
Person to person seems to go a little slow. Are there any public
broadcasting channels that NCN has utilized? Paid programming is big in New
York. Do we have the means (funds, connections, etc.) to get this out? I
am a Amateur Radio Technician Class (HAM Licensed), capable of long range
communications. With this as a form of communication, we could discuss
ideas, but "Business or Public announcements" are forbidden by the F.C.C. If
any of this helps out, please let me know.
Charles Schwager
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Brad Canham <F4rword@aol.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 16:17:02 EST
Subject: Re: NCN Organization as income producing
I'd like to suggest the NCN membership review Paul Ray's study (Noetic
Sciences) on value-oriented markets to determine the direction of any profit
oriented NCN venture.
I did a marketing management plan for the Utne Reader that successfully
parlayed the market of the Ray study into an income producing set of markets
(particularly for the online Utne Cafe).
It isn't an easy process, but it works. NCN is a similar value oriented
virtual organization and the Ray study will give everyone a basic
understanding of value-oriented markets/relationship marketing and how to
build them.
Brad Canham
CEO
F4M, LLC
612-879-9820
F4M
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Adam Pollock <pollock@phoenixat.com>
Subject: Re: NCN Organization
Ok people, enough stagnation. I am cutting to the chase, yes yes, I know,
who am I and all. Well, my name is Adam and I am 15, shocker. Hello,
*handshake* now on to business. People, you all have great visions, I do to,
nothing wrong with that, nothing at all. The thing is, if you do nothing to act
on it, you have wasted more of you're personal creative energy, so people, a
solution to the problem is as follows :
make a list(s) of your ideas
prioritize or organize from relatively small to big
start with the small
Here's what I mean. I am into holistic living very much, I still have my toes
in the water but I have yet to immerse myself, my problem is that I am just
procrastinating, and I wanna move on. So what do i do? I buy a few plants on
impulse and plant them with loving care and full headedness of what I plan to
do with them. Well, I kept them going for about four weeks. But others things
distracted me, and although I really need the living chi of plants in my room,
I didn't keep up with them. Why? well, four plants need a lot of attention, not
something I am yet equipped to give. So what did I do? I took one plant, one my
sister never paid any attention to, and I have been watering it and using the
The Celestine Prophecy technique of aura empowerment on it when I can, and the
plant is tall and a second is sprouting from the bulb. I am proud i got one
plant this way, made it live, helped it, and as I keep living with the plant, I
can learn to take on more responsibility.
So my message is to start cultivating your visions, water them and give
them energy, and they will manifest as desired and make changes they find
necessary. Now if you will excuse me, I am off to water the plant ;}
Adam
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Kathryn Brown <kjmcqb@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: True Reframing
Reframing!!! What one does when designing a NEW concept that can
hopefully serve AS a framework for a growing "social" group.
I am beginning with the idea of $, money, mediums of exchange, 'economic
energy sources.'
NCN NEEDS $! How shall we get some?
* We will create something so fabulous, durable, and one-of-a-kind that
subscribers' will volunteer to pay for the privilege of reading,
discussing, utilising, participating in our ?
** * Are NCN sites already so popular that they will be able to
exist on subscriptions? The members-only sites I know of offer
specialty text, images, &/or information. They went to subs only
after achieving large numbers of "regular visitors."
Addicts? How shall we create some?
* Now that we have all these subscribers, what shall we do with them?
**** Traditionally, the fact of $ support buys only what is stated
in the charter. Since NCNs' pride is the NON traditional... How to
remain so? Non-monetary or barter members? These may wish to
trade --for instance, time as a chat room monitor, creating specialty
algorithms or checker programs so there'll be no ballot-stuffing, if we
get to an "only members can vote" concept. Will the barter
members have more votes than the $ people? What kind of "caste
system " shall we have?
* And what shall we do with subscription funds and who shall decide this?
(New civilizations quite frequently form to escape
bean-countage and its many functions)
*********Special note, readers may find of value the short story "I.O.U."
by Shirley Jackson, found in the collection "Just an Ordinary Day."
The introduction and spreading of true token economies has never been
sincerely attempted---or reported fully? *For instance, nearly
all of Australias' hospitals were built with public subscription
funds---also known as "numbers games," lotteries, etc. There are
real estate, utilities districts, and farming collectives everywhere, etc.
Obviously, what works best is a truly commonly desired goal, with ALL the
funds going toward that one goal. Within the whatever "New Frame."
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Volmarr Bryyan Wyrd" <volmarr@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: NCN Organization [from Bruce B.]
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 15:17:57 -0500
Try Yahoo Clubs. They are free and already exist and are the best best for
organizing clubs and events and has a chat room and places to put links and
place where you can post photos etc. Yahoo Clubs are at
http://clubs.yahoo.com . Also come see my club for the metaphysical. Its
Lost Purple Wizards of the Nada Tree
http://clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/lostpurplewizardofthenada . Please come join. I
started it August 31,1998 and now it is over 750 members. Whats major cool
about Yahoo is all there free thing all work together in an intregrated.
Like there chat pager, there chat, there free email, user profiles, etc. And
it is all free. Well have fun!
Namaste,
Volmarr
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: James North <JamesNorth@Uni-verse.net>
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 13:17:06 -0700
Subject: Re: NCN Organization
Thank you Flemming. I invite you and the whole NCNetwork to join
The Uni-v.e.r.s.e. Your message reflected the thinking that attracted me
to NCN
in the first place, and I believe what's on the table for The
Uni-v.e.r.s.e. would be
attractive to the NCN -- The Uni-v.e.r.s.e. was born out of a new way of
thinking.
Personally, I see the economic/profitable aspect of The Uni-v.e.r.s.e.
being the
most significant means to a "New Civilization". The current, or "old" one
grew out
of commerce, and why re-invent the wheel?
Take a look at http://www.uni-verse.net , view it as a whole, join iU and
tell me what
you think.....
Cheers!
James North
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "AGRAWAL P.K (MSD_PAYROLL)" <pka21715@telco.co.in>
Subject: RE: NCN Organization
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 10:33:13 +0530
Only one comment. We must have some core belief which differentiates us from
the rest. It may be as simple as tolerance, respect etc. If we can't define
who belongs to NCN, let us at least define who doesn't. If we don't do that,
we can't have any coherence.
With love,
P K Agrawal
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: David Bartholomew <hyphenate@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: NCN Organization-- a call to action
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 99 11:42:46 -0800
Hi Flemming,
Shooting straight from the hip, and political correctness be damned
I've been brainstorming on the ideas of intentional communities,new
paradigms, etc. since I was about 10 (in 1970... do the math). The Flag
of Earth that I saw back then inspired questions on the motivation behind
national borders, the "divide and conquer" feel of this "Tower of Babel"
where people can't speak to each other, and more. I was reading the
"Aquarian Conspiracy" and other seminal works as they came hot off the
press. And since then I have been on an unceasing "fact-finding mission"
on how to make what has now come to be called "whole systems living",
"simple living", your name here, possible.
Well, one certainty that has presented itself again and again is-- that
people will yap about what they say they want... up until the time they
have to do something about it.
It might inconvenience them. It might cause them to invest themselves.
To back up what they say with action. To be out there in the world. It
might push their buttons. They might have to show up. It might be "in
their stuff". There are as many reasons as there are those not walking
their talk.
Well, I have found that many New Civvers are no different. There is a
lot of talk, and then when there has been a call for action (financial
help, volunteering, or otherwise) it feels like few have stepped to a
degree commensurate with their strong words and posture.
I gauge this by noting how often you-- Flemming-- have had to re-solicit
help.
I have always tried to give something at these junctures. And I know I
could be doing more as well. I at least feel that I have walked my talk
(and continue to do so with respect to the One World Flag in the same
position as yourself in that venture).
So what I would call for is-- dues taking the form of $$, or a number of
hours of donated volunteer time that calculates out to the equivalent
amount. And if people have a problem with helping, then that would speak
to their claim of wanting New Civ to progress.
You've done a Herculean job of constantly trying to work with this new
paradigm... this unknown quantity. And it has to get frustrating when
people don't rise to the occasion.
I don't necessarily subscribe to the fact that everyone has to agree on
any order of business. Even in a world where people have worked out their
"stuff", it would be hard to reach a unanimous decision on anything.
[There's also the conversation of what the world would look like if we
all did agree... which I don't think would be interesting... and speaks
exactly to why looking for complete agreement is probably looking in the
wrong direction.]
What I do believe is-- that anyone who's stated purpose is the betterment
of this planet, searching out greater solutions in the areas that benefit
us all, etc.... can get past any disagreements or personality clashes
with respect to the "small stuff" on the way to that goal. Period.
Seems to me that's what New Civ is all about-- getting past the small
stuff. Small thinking, small living, war, famine, injustice, intolerance,
inequality, you know-- small stuff.
One area where we tend to show where our small stuff lies is in the area
of money. I hear a lot of yapping about "money is bad, that's the old
paradigm, bartering is the thing", whatever. Well people-- it's all
energy. It's all symbolic. It just represents what we are willing to
have for ourselves. It stands for what value we place on objects or
services. It's not the money that is evil. One doesn't have to do with
money what someone in the past has done. If you take money out of the
equation, you will replace it with bartering or another concept... but
that will still be the same thing-- i.e., symbolic of what you are worth,
and telling of that on which you place value.
Where abundance or affluence in any area of life is an issue, some
concept of how to measure one's receptivity or resistance to it will
always be in place. It is an archetype. It is a large, blinking, neon
arrow pointing to where work may be done before it's no longer an issue.
Calling a spade a spade-- often I see people hiding behind the "I don't
believe in money" argument... who are simply... freeloading. They are
taking something without investing or contributing anything. They are
throwing out more negative than positive. Some have more at stake in
causing a ruckus or being the curmudgeon, than working (read- WORK-ing)
toward a solution.
I have seen this in some of those at New Civ Salons. I have read it in
various postings. I don't think these people are being honest. And I
don't think we are helping any of us by enabling them to continue (my mom
used to call this "giving one the Shamey Finger").
The place we are left at is this: We all say we want change. Well what
are we willing to do for it? If New Civ is of value to you... if you
are to be of value in the new civilization... what will you do to keep it
going?
A COUPLE OF IDEAS
*As in a telethon, I challenge every NCN member to put forth the
equivalent of $50, whether it be in cash, hours, or a combination of both
(if you don't have the $, I know you can find the time). It's time to
stop letting Flemming foot the bill.
*Schedule a couple days, name a time and place where New Civvers can show
up to DO what needs to be done to further New Civ. Where we can write,
lick envelopes, file, make computer entries... do something, anything,
that might actually help the infrastructure... which, in turn, might help
each of us to manifest our individual expression a little easier.
I realize that the rigors of our individual projects, endeavors, causes,
and paths are-- to some degree or another-- overwhelming. AND I know
that there is always a way to fit in what needs to be done.
My check is in the mail. And I'll offer to Flemming to put in a few
hours doing what needs to be done.
Namaste',
David Bartholomew
originator- The One World Flag
david@oneworldflag.org
http://www.oneworldflag.org
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Paul Tifford <ptiffor1@elp.rr.com>
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 14:50:44 +0000
Subject: Re: NCN Organization
We offer our organizations to the 3,000 members of NCN:
Action NOW! for political action.
Allone for the unity of all religions.
GOD-ONE for spiritual awareness.
-- Wishing you Health,Happiness,Peace,Love and Bliss, now and always.* Paul Tifford : ptiffor1@elp.rr.com
Action NOW! : actionnow@onelist.com URL: http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/actionnow
Allone:Allone@onelist.com URL:http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/Allone
GOD-ONE:God-ONE@onelist.com URL:http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/GOD-ONE
GOD: http://members.tripod.com/~actionnow/GOD-Index.html
------------------------------------------------------------------------
o o / \------------------ Flemming A. Funch -------------------/ \ / * \ New Civilization Network / Synchronicity Networks / * \ / * * \ ffunch@newciv.org / * * \ o-------o----------- http://www.worldtrans.org/ -----------o-------o
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